The gender performance spectrum has been so central to my life.
I grew up with a mom who knew no currency other being skinny and blonde with big boobs, then I joined the military where I found it was best to just be one of the guys. No makeup, don’t draw attention to yourself. Laugh at their crude jokes, don’t be offended by anything. Then when a woman arrived at my command who did wear makeup and was offended (rightly so) by their crude jokes I realized that maybe I did what was best for myself but also did a great disservice to women who came after me by not performing my gender.
Now I’m in an industry that’s only about 7% female . If you are a woman who embraces femininity, you are a DEI hire. If not, you must be a lesbian…but you’re also a DEI hire.
You ladies nailed this. Thank you for so eloquently laying this out. I contemplate the absurdity of this every time I am sitting in the chair getting my 4 hour balayage done ... which was 2 weeks ago. "When you don’t perform your gender in a way that allows us to assign it capital – its huge fucking problem" nailed it, mic drop. May I suggest an episode on tech bro billionaires screaming about low fertility rates? Would love to hear your take on this.
I came across this article from the Economist titled "Can the rich world escape its baby crisis?" outlining how more than 1/2 the drop in America’s total fertility rate is attributed to women under the age of 19 now having next to no children - so a decline in teen pregnancy - by be helpful to highlight :) - https://www.economist.com/finance-and-economics/2024/05/21/can-the-rich-world-escape-its-baby-crisis
Yes!!! It’s like a third of the episode rn, I thought the article was so interesting — it’s also weird because a lot of the coverage from the WSJ just straight up ignores the invention of the birth control pill and feigns confusion about the downturn beginning in the 1960s / attributes it to women getting jobs lol
Back to comment again - I grew up in the purity culture of the 90s where we were all "saving ourselves" and looking for a "man of God" to choose us. And I subscribed to a lot of the teachings around "don't waste your time with those frivolous materialistic things." One of the best parts of growing up and growing out of this religious doctrine was the realization that I really like pretty things. I feel good wearing accessories. I like wearing makeup and reading magazines, etc etc.
Today I do the things that I enjoy and continually try to reassess if I value them the way I used to. Ie - still value the highlights, dont value the nails as much. Now, I absolutely agree with Caro that these ideas were not mine alone. I was influenced by the capitalistic market that is continually telling me how I can improve... But I struggle with balancing between the line of finding joy in my physical expression and using it to communicate a certain message. Vs feeling stuck in those confines.
this was awesome you guys are sooooo right about the abortion stuff too like we need people who are pro abortion to be vocally pro abortion for everyone and not just hide behind the “well what about rape and incest??”. like no say you support abortion because you think abortion is actually fully okay!!!!! with your CHEST
EATING DISORDERS AS AFFIRMING GENDER CARE 😭☠️ I truly enjoy these sessions. Keep em' coming, ladies! (Also please don't mind my constant use of humor in any topic... these conversations are causing me to think about and question at least ONE THING by the time the episode is finished, I just don't know how not to make everything a joke, plus you're both fucking hilarious lol)
Oh my goodness you said "there is a loss you have when you view your body subconsciously as a commodity to be improved all the time. And the loss is that you are never in your body." This hit so hard.
This whole episode so on point, I was watching the Olympics at the gym and the majority of the US volleyball team all had blonde (fake) ponytails and it got me thinking along the same lines as you described, 2% of the population but 85% of the white women we see.
My own personal journey with appearance performance was that when I had a sudden medical condition rear its ugly head all of a sudden it was way way way more valuable to me to get 15 minutes of sleep rather than wake up and put on even the minimal makeup I had been wearing. While I don't recommend heart failure, having those months where I just didn't have the energy to put into my appearance have led to me continuing to avoid it on an ongoing basis. Taking a break can show you just how little impact it can have. Really weird to get used to though especially in pictures and it definitely helps if you're already in a relationship if you are in your 30's growing up being told nonsense like what that creep told Katie about blonde hair.
This episode is excellent. Thank you so much for the discussion. Something that deeply disturbed me in reading about the recent gender related case argued in the Supreme Court, was the lawyers for the state of TN acknowledging that they know that testosterone for cis boys is gender affirming care among many examples, and that they’re ok with it. The straight up truth is that they’re ok with gender affirming care, just only for people who are trying to be more affirmed in the gender they were assigned at birth. They said the state has a vested interest in this. THiS is what I cannot understand. Any thoughts or insight into this?
Imane Khelif is a confirmed biological male (known since puberty when Khelif failed to menstruate because Khelif has internal testes and typical male levels of testosterone). When did it become progressive to let males punch women for sport at the Olympics?
Oh man this dental stuff rings true. I have had braces 3x: once in second grade, only on my front four teeth, idk why, once in the 5th-7th grade timeline, I also promptly lost my retainer and my mom refused to buy another one, and then, because of the lost retainer/trauma/stress, I had gum recession from grinding my teeth at night and my regular dentist recommended re-straightening them as a way to stave off a gum graft, which are very painful and expensive and don’t always work. I was twenty-seven and also had health insurance so I opted to do it. I never fact-checked it and had also wanted to re-straighten my teeth because vanity/shame that I had lost my retainer.
It was a weird experience: I didn’t necessarily hate my crooked teeth but I did feel like they made me look more white trash, which I am, and it was more how other people responded to them that I didn’t like. A friend’s ex-husband, who was a pos, made a comment about them one time, my sister said something, and the first orthodontist I saw straight up said “you’re such a beautiful girl with such ugly teeth.” Combine that with being an actor and I did it, even though I definitely didn’t have 3k to spend. Interestingly enough, the ortho I ended up choosing was the first medical professional to suggest that I had anxiety, I think he phrased it “mental issues,” because of the state of my gums/grinding. I got offended but it ended up that he was right. I never ended up finishing the treatment, I lost my job and insurance and still had a few trays to go but my dentist stopped warning me about gum grafts so I figured they were fixed enough. I ended up getting a night guard to help with the grinding, plus meds and therapy and think it’s better, in my non-dentist opinion.
I live in England now and am married to a Brit and love “bad” teeth. It drives me crazy how many celebrities get veneers and how big and fake and white they look.
😂 It is pretty perfect for me. I also really enjoy how there’s less injectibles/the quality isn’t as good here, so I’m not constantly thinking I’m aging and no one else around me is. I’m not sure if the NHS covers dental work, or whether or not that would be good, but just to your point of, “other countries don’t have the same obsession with straightening teeth the US does and have similar results,” I think the UK’s reputation for bad teeth, in my unresearched opinion, is often because people don’t like how they look, not that they don’t serve the functions humans need them to - for defense, mastication, etc.
The gender performance spectrum has been so central to my life.
I grew up with a mom who knew no currency other being skinny and blonde with big boobs, then I joined the military where I found it was best to just be one of the guys. No makeup, don’t draw attention to yourself. Laugh at their crude jokes, don’t be offended by anything. Then when a woman arrived at my command who did wear makeup and was offended (rightly so) by their crude jokes I realized that maybe I did what was best for myself but also did a great disservice to women who came after me by not performing my gender.
Now I’m in an industry that’s only about 7% female . If you are a woman who embraces femininity, you are a DEI hire. If not, you must be a lesbian…but you’re also a DEI hire.
It’s all a zero sum game that is so exhausting.
Ugh, absolutely fucking exhausting is right. The choice is between survival or increasing the friction for yourself for (probably) no payoff.
Because men are not attracted to looks. They are attracted to status and compliance.
Thank you for your work Ladies!
"status and compliance" damn, that hits
You ladies nailed this. Thank you for so eloquently laying this out. I contemplate the absurdity of this every time I am sitting in the chair getting my 4 hour balayage done ... which was 2 weeks ago. "When you don’t perform your gender in a way that allows us to assign it capital – its huge fucking problem" nailed it, mic drop. May I suggest an episode on tech bro billionaires screaming about low fertility rates? Would love to hear your take on this.
HA I’m actually working on an episode about that very topic for the money with Katie show right now because holy SHIT is it bleak
I came across this article from the Economist titled "Can the rich world escape its baby crisis?" outlining how more than 1/2 the drop in America’s total fertility rate is attributed to women under the age of 19 now having next to no children - so a decline in teen pregnancy - by be helpful to highlight :) - https://www.economist.com/finance-and-economics/2024/05/21/can-the-rich-world-escape-its-baby-crisis
Yes!!! It’s like a third of the episode rn, I thought the article was so interesting — it’s also weird because a lot of the coverage from the WSJ just straight up ignores the invention of the birth control pill and feigns confusion about the downturn beginning in the 1960s / attributes it to women getting jobs lol
The parasocial relationship is kicking in hard with this one! I want to talk with you all about structualism and free will!
Not "JD ✨️little bitch✨️ Vance" 😩😭☠️
wow wow wow. this was so spot on... sitting her w/ my highlights and botox but yes... you nailed it.
Thank you so much for listening! Sincerely a woman with painted nails who's about to go paint her face lol
thank you so much for listening! signed, another woman with highlights and a dip manicure, dutifully performing her gender
Back to comment again - I grew up in the purity culture of the 90s where we were all "saving ourselves" and looking for a "man of God" to choose us. And I subscribed to a lot of the teachings around "don't waste your time with those frivolous materialistic things." One of the best parts of growing up and growing out of this religious doctrine was the realization that I really like pretty things. I feel good wearing accessories. I like wearing makeup and reading magazines, etc etc.
Today I do the things that I enjoy and continually try to reassess if I value them the way I used to. Ie - still value the highlights, dont value the nails as much. Now, I absolutely agree with Caro that these ideas were not mine alone. I was influenced by the capitalistic market that is continually telling me how I can improve... But I struggle with balancing between the line of finding joy in my physical expression and using it to communicate a certain message. Vs feeling stuck in those confines.
this was awesome you guys are sooooo right about the abortion stuff too like we need people who are pro abortion to be vocally pro abortion for everyone and not just hide behind the “well what about rape and incest??”. like no say you support abortion because you think abortion is actually fully okay!!!!! with your CHEST
EATING DISORDERS AS AFFIRMING GENDER CARE 😭☠️ I truly enjoy these sessions. Keep em' coming, ladies! (Also please don't mind my constant use of humor in any topic... these conversations are causing me to think about and question at least ONE THING by the time the episode is finished, I just don't know how not to make everything a joke, plus you're both fucking hilarious lol)
Oh my gosh Alyssa thank you!!! I’m so happy you’re enjoying them as much as we are lmao
Oh my goodness you said "there is a loss you have when you view your body subconsciously as a commodity to be improved all the time. And the loss is that you are never in your body." This hit so hard.
This whole episode so on point, I was watching the Olympics at the gym and the majority of the US volleyball team all had blonde (fake) ponytails and it got me thinking along the same lines as you described, 2% of the population but 85% of the white women we see.
My own personal journey with appearance performance was that when I had a sudden medical condition rear its ugly head all of a sudden it was way way way more valuable to me to get 15 minutes of sleep rather than wake up and put on even the minimal makeup I had been wearing. While I don't recommend heart failure, having those months where I just didn't have the energy to put into my appearance have led to me continuing to avoid it on an ongoing basis. Taking a break can show you just how little impact it can have. Really weird to get used to though especially in pictures and it definitely helps if you're already in a relationship if you are in your 30's growing up being told nonsense like what that creep told Katie about blonde hair.
This episode is excellent. Thank you so much for the discussion. Something that deeply disturbed me in reading about the recent gender related case argued in the Supreme Court, was the lawyers for the state of TN acknowledging that they know that testosterone for cis boys is gender affirming care among many examples, and that they’re ok with it. The straight up truth is that they’re ok with gender affirming care, just only for people who are trying to be more affirmed in the gender they were assigned at birth. They said the state has a vested interest in this. THiS is what I cannot understand. Any thoughts or insight into this?
Imane Khelif is a confirmed biological male (known since puberty when Khelif failed to menstruate because Khelif has internal testes and typical male levels of testosterone). When did it become progressive to let males punch women for sport at the Olympics?
Oh man this dental stuff rings true. I have had braces 3x: once in second grade, only on my front four teeth, idk why, once in the 5th-7th grade timeline, I also promptly lost my retainer and my mom refused to buy another one, and then, because of the lost retainer/trauma/stress, I had gum recession from grinding my teeth at night and my regular dentist recommended re-straightening them as a way to stave off a gum graft, which are very painful and expensive and don’t always work. I was twenty-seven and also had health insurance so I opted to do it. I never fact-checked it and had also wanted to re-straighten my teeth because vanity/shame that I had lost my retainer.
It was a weird experience: I didn’t necessarily hate my crooked teeth but I did feel like they made me look more white trash, which I am, and it was more how other people responded to them that I didn’t like. A friend’s ex-husband, who was a pos, made a comment about them one time, my sister said something, and the first orthodontist I saw straight up said “you’re such a beautiful girl with such ugly teeth.” Combine that with being an actor and I did it, even though I definitely didn’t have 3k to spend. Interestingly enough, the ortho I ended up choosing was the first medical professional to suggest that I had anxiety, I think he phrased it “mental issues,” because of the state of my gums/grinding. I got offended but it ended up that he was right. I never ended up finishing the treatment, I lost my job and insurance and still had a few trays to go but my dentist stopped warning me about gum grafts so I figured they were fixed enough. I ended up getting a night guard to help with the grinding, plus meds and therapy and think it’s better, in my non-dentist opinion.
I live in England now and am married to a Brit and love “bad” teeth. It drives me crazy how many celebrities get veneers and how big and fake and white they look.
Do you know what’s so funny is as I was reading this comment, my thought was “god I hope she moved to the UK” AND YOU DID AND I AM SO HAPPY FOR YOU
But also thank you!
😂 It is pretty perfect for me. I also really enjoy how there’s less injectibles/the quality isn’t as good here, so I’m not constantly thinking I’m aging and no one else around me is. I’m not sure if the NHS covers dental work, or whether or not that would be good, but just to your point of, “other countries don’t have the same obsession with straightening teeth the US does and have similar results,” I think the UK’s reputation for bad teeth, in my unresearched opinion, is often because people don’t like how they look, not that they don’t serve the functions humans need them to - for defense, mastication, etc.